A SAHM Twist With A Working Mom: Jo Piazza’s Dual Roles
In this episode of Mom to MORE®, host Sharon Macey is joined by Jo Piazza, international bestselling author, acclaimed podcast creator, and mom of three feral children.
Jo’s books, including The Sicilian Inheritance, We Are Not Like Them, and How to Be Married, have been published internationally and optioned for film and TV. She’s also the creative force behind podcasts like Under the Influence, which explores the influencer economy, and Committed, featuring stories about modern relationships.
Jo shares her unique perspective on how she dedicates those precious 6 hours a day to work when her kids are in school, while balancing an impressive career in writing and podcasting while raising her three children. With humor and authenticity, she discusses the challenges of maintaining efficiency, prioritizing self-care, and embracing the chaos of motherhood.
Tune in for a rich conversation that dives into Jo’s creative process, her thoughts on the evolving landscape of motherhood, and the inspiration behind her latest best-selling novel, The Sicilian Inheritance.
[00:00] Introduction
[02:33] Jo’s journey as a working mom balancing motherhood and a career in storytelling
[05:43] Embracing imperfection: Why “done is better than perfect.”
[07:30] How motherhood has influenced Jo’s creative voice
[12:08] The importance of self-care in the thick of parenting
[18:59] Accepting help to thrive as a mom and creator.
[22:58] The Sicilian Inheritance: A twisty, poignant novel exploring motherhood and ambition
[27:24] Jo’s MORE - Hint: It involves taking to the skies!
Meet My Guest Jo Piazza
Instagram: @JoPiazzaAuthor
Podcast: Under the Influence
Substack: Over the Influence
Website: https://www.jopiazza.com/
Jo’s most recent best-selling novel, The Sicilian Inheritance: https://go.sylikes.com/eNyVoRDkfHry
Looking for More? Follow @momtomore on Instagram, Facebook and TikTok. @Sharon Macey on LinkedIn.
Keep an eye out for episode #29 of the Mom to MORE™ podcast where Sharon is joined by Missy Tannen, co-founder of the luxury bedding company Boll & Branch. Coming soon - you won’t want to miss it ♥
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Sharon (00:59)
Welcome back to Mom to More. Okay. I am so excited about today's guest, the bestselling author, podcast creator, and award-winning journalist, Joe Piazza. Joe is the national and international bestselling author of The Sicilian Inheritance. We are not like them. You are always mine.
Charlotte Walsh Likes to Win, The Knockoff, and How to Be Married. Her work has been published in 10 languages in 12 countries, and four of her books have been optioned for film and television. Woohoo! Jo's podcasts have garnered more than 25 million downloads, that's huge, and regularly topped the podcast charts. She's an editor, columnist, and travel writer, and I you said the Sicilian Inheritance was an epic travelogue.
And her work has appeared in the Wall Street Journal, New York Times, New York Magazine, Marie Claire, and Glamour, just to name a few. And she is the mom of three feral children. Well, aren't they all? So hello. They are. Hello, Joe. I'm so thrilled you're here. And hi. So good to see you. I want to give a shout out. You and I first met at the Mom 2.0 Conference in April of 24.
Jo (01:43)
Yeah
They are. They really are. Yeah.
Hi, thanks so much for having me.
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (02:12)
I got your book, we're gonna talk about it, The Sicilian Inheritance, amazing. And we're gonna dive into that a little later. But first, we're gonna talk about some mom stuff. How about that? All right, let's do it. So I wanted to have you on because you have a unique mom journey and all mom journeys are really unique. But you have a slightly different point of view from most of the moms that I interview. And that is of a working mom, a mom who was also home with her kids and you work from home.
Jo (02:22)
Let's do it. Yeah, great.
Mmm.
Sharon (02:39)
most of the time, which is to me saying, cray cray, right? Double duty plus mom stuff, plus work stuff, And I feel that it's important to really highlight and honor the various roads that all moms travel down. So, yeah.
Jo (02:40)
Yah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah, true,
true. And I feel like my mom journey, it's been about eight years now. And it's changed every, I mean, it's constantly shifting, you know, how I do this, how I get it done. Because for these eight years, I've really been working for myself, I run my own business. And so that's wonderful in that I get to set my own boundaries and terrible in that I'm never really off.
And so I'm just constantly trying to figure out what does this balance look like of having three children and also, you know, trying to be a successful writer, podcaster, content creator in the world.
Sharon (03:39)
And you have a lot going on. mean, it's clear to me that you have an incredible amount of drive and creativity bursting inside of you. And you are straddling, there's something going on in there.
Jo (03:50)
There's something. There's something bursting inside me. Yeah.
Sharon (03:54)
But you are also straddling what I'll call that dual rail of motherhood and work. And that, you know, are you driven to write and create and talk about
Jo (03:59)
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (04:06)
this inner wellspring and what feeds you. Where does all that come from?
Jo (04:09)
Mm-hmm.
You know, I have to say, like, I've always been incredibly driven and creative and also fast with what I can produce. And I attribute that to being a newspaper journalist for so long, you're on a deadline, you have to get stuff done. But becoming a mom has just made me a lot more efficient. And so like, as my brain is bursting with all of these things that I want to get done, I have a very finite window to do them.
And I'm, you know, very religious about creating a to-do list at the beginning of the day and getting through all of it. People do ask me a lot at book events and stuff, you know, how do you get it all done? And I'm like, I do not mess around. That's the thing. I don't scroll Instagram. Like I'm not on, my husband is on Twitter all the time. don't even understand it anymore. It's a ridiculous thing. forget it. Like I don't really...
Sharon (05:05)
Twitter's, forget it, yeah.
Jo (05:10)
you know, indulge in lot of distractions anymore. And, and yeah, I just I kind of have these priorities of what I want to do and make sure that I do them as best I can. And also, I do want to say, I truly believe that perfect is the enemy of done. And so like, I do not believe or something to make sure it is perfect. I'm like, is it finished? Cool.
Sharon (05:35)
Right, right. And you know, it's funny you said that
when I went back to work as a branding content strategist, I remember that my supervisor said to me, done is better than perfect. And I just have that in my brain. And that is so, so true. It's, it's good enough. Cause I could noodle and noodle all day. And I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah. All right.
Jo (05:40)
Mm-hmm.
Yes.
It's good enough. Yes, yes. I
mean, it's really my mantra. It really, really is. And that's how I get through most of my days.
Sharon (06:00)
Okay, I get that, I get that. So how has having kids inspired your writing, affected your writing? Talk about that.
Jo (06:06)
Hmm.
my gosh, I mean, in so many ways, I have to say that having these kids, it has cracked open my brain in so many new, interesting ways. It makes me look at the world completely differently because I will say, you by the time you hit 35, so many of us are just jaded and freaking over it. And now I get to experience the world through their eyes, which is sometimes terrible and sometimes wonderful, but it's a new perspective.
And so I think that has given me like a new boost of creativity in a lot of ways. But then also, I think that my ability to write from the perspective of not just parents, but caregivers generally has just really, really changed and with Sicilian inheritance and also with my last book that I co-wrote with my co-writer, Christine Pride, You Are Always Mine.
Both of those focus strongly on themes of motherhood. What is a quote unquote good mother who quote deserves to be a mother? And the choices, the hard choices that we make as mothers, and I never would have been able to write either of those two books if I hadn't become a mom, yeah, absolutely.
Sharon (07:27)
without being a mom, yeah, yeah,
yeah. It does open your eyes to things that you never expected, emotions you never realized you had, and the ability to do everything that you need to get done, right? I mean, think about all the things you do in a day. There's a crisis, there's a whatever, you handle it, right? Because we have to.
Jo (07:44)
Yeah, yeah.
because we have to. I mean, one of my kids pooped their pants at school today and we had to get them home and figure out the rest of the day. And I'm still here, still doing it.
Sharon (08:01)
There you go. I'm glad. Thank you for carving out the time today. I appreciate that. Been there, been there, been there. So I get a sense also that pushing boundaries is part of who you are. And don't we do that every single day as moms and how all of this makes you a better mom and teaching you like lessons that you're teaching your kids.
Jo (08:05)
Yeah, yeah.
Mm-hmm.
you know, I mean, I have never had to pivot more in my life than I do as a mother. There's no way that I can be that I can construct some kind of plan and be like, this is gonna go well. Because it won't because you have to constantly, constantly be changing at the drop of a hat. And I think that's
Sharon (08:35)
Exactly.
Jo (08:48)
it's become a part of who I am, honestly, in all of my dealings in life, I'm ready to make a change immediately, if it's going to have a better or easier outcome. I also think that that is a skill that is not just unique to mothers per se, but unique to women, because my husband cannot do it.
and know a lot of men cannot do it. He's like, this is the plan. And I'm like, not anymore. Not anymore, my friend.
Sharon (09:14)
interesting.
Right, right. We have the amazing ability to pivot and just quick go down a whole different pathway. Yeah. And that's, And I think I would call that a superpower, but we're going to take a quick break. And when we come back, we're going to dig into your mom skills and superpowers when we return.
Jo (09:27)
Whole different pathway, yeah.
Sharon (10:09)
All right, so Joe, let's talk about some of the skills that you have developed and honed from your time as a mom. Give me like your top three or five, whatever comes to the top of your head,
Jo (10:15)
Mm.
all of my crazy superpowers that I've developed as a I don't know why. Yeah, I don't know why Marvel just hasn't had a mom superhero yet. Just yeah. that wasn't Marvel. I don't think that was Marvel. I don't know. Yeah, yeah, no. my gosh. All right, let me let me think. I because I think I've named a lot of them already. I mean, my efficiency is one of them. I can my
Sharon (10:25)
Superpower skills thing, yeah.
Well, they did, right? The Incredibles? That wasn't Marvel, though. Yeah, you're right. It was a Marvel. That's my favorite. Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Right.
Jo (10:48)
my workday as it is right now is about six hours of work a day. And, you know, I'm producing three podcasts in that time right now I'm working on two books, two ish three probably books actively, I've got a sub stack.
Yeah. I mean, it's definitely, efficiency is a really, really big one. I also think I've developed intense powers of, of persuasion. I mean, I am in constant, constant negotiations. I could have an entire new career of negotiating with kidnappers. And I think I would get, get the person back literally every time, every time.
Sharon (11:22)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, without
having to pay a dime.
Jo (11:34)
I would never pay a time, no, will never give in. Mm-mm, mm-mm, because I do this every minute of every day. But what I've gotten really good at lately, I will say, is attempting to take care of myself. Because when you're constantly caregiving for other people all of the time, finding a way to care for yourself matters I think, more than ever.
Sharon (11:37)
Right. Right.
Jo (12:03)
So I've really prioritized that more than I ever have in my life. And I'm really proud that I finally developed that skill.
Sharon (12:09)
And you know what?
Good for you. I'm like so thrilled to hear that because so many moms in the thick of it, like my kids are older than yours. I'm older than you, my kids are older than yours. But it's so easy to get lost and to get downtrodden from that. And so I applaud you for actually recognizing that you matter and that it is so important that you take this time for yourself, whatever it is. It could be 15 minutes, but you're doing that for you. And that's so vital.
Jo (12:26)
Mm-hmm.
Thank you.
Mm-hmm.
It's true, it's true. mean, and this is a recent thing. Again, I'm eight years into this crazy parenting journey. I've got a seven-year-old, a five-year-old, and an almost two-year-old. So I am in the thick of it. It's boy, girl, girl.
Sharon (12:51)
And do have any girls?
Boy, girl, girl. Okay, so just wait, honey. Yeah. Okay, okay. Yeah.
Jo (12:57)
I don't, it's already happened, okay? Like it's already happening. Like I just, I,
yeah, it's, I can smell it. I can smell it in the air.
Sharon (13:07)
Right, As it is, but we're learning from it every single day, that's for sure. You know, I also want to point out that you're younger than me. And what I have noticed over the last like 15 years is that the world has really changed when it comes to, you know, the freelance and the remote workplace. Like when my kids were younger, I was either working in an office,
Jo (13:08)
It's gonna be a lot. It's gonna be a lot.
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
Mmm. Mm-hmm.
Sharon (13:34)
or I was at home with, was working at home, you know, raising the kids. And that I think now it's so much easier to stay connected to the things you love and explore new things and, freelance. and it's just so much more organic and I'm not gonna say easy cause it's hard. but so many of our opportunities, so difficult, so difficult opportunities that you've got that I just didn't have back then, which is not even that long ago.
Jo (13:36)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Still hard, still hard, yeah, yeah.
Yeah,
it's not even that long ago. And honestly, I think back to when I used to work in magazines in New York, and I think about the women that were mothers there. We were at that office until seven o'clock at night, okay? On almost a regular basis. If I had that schedule now, I'd never see my kids.
because I also left home at seven to get to the office. mean, or the very latest at eight. So I wouldn't be doing drop-off, I wouldn't be doing pickup, and I would get home just before bedtime. My kids eat at six, right? So like, I don't know how I would function in that world now. I work a ton. I mean, I feel like I'm doing a lot of work, but like I said, I'm just doing it in a shorter amount of time now, but that's only possible because I can build
my own hours.
Sharon (14:57)
Right. Which is so nice. And also, let's talk a little bit about, I guess, the difficulty of being a working mom. I I love how you have organized your day. You are just diligent about, okay, this is the six hours and I got to fit everything in and you're not the first mom who I've interviewed who has said that. But yes, it makes you so much more efficient and you're like, boom, boom, boom, you've got to get this stuff done. But talk about the difficulty of being that working mom. Are you missing things?
Jo (15:04)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
no, I we can't be there for everything. I will say actually, no, to be honest, like I've really and I've worked hard to do this. Like this did not just happen. My schedule is so intentional, right? So I've created a world where I am typically the class mom. I volunteer at my kids school, I do drop off for one of them.
every day, one out of one, one or two, like, so I either do the baby or I take the bigs. And I'm generally around for like, I don't, I don't actually I no longer I've been working on not having any mom guilt. And I no longer actually have have guilt around that. So like, you know, you show up for them a lot. They're also with a caregiver a lot we haven't I'm very open about we have an au pair who lives with us. She's wonderful. My mom lives nearby. She helps out a lot.
I would not be a good parent if I were not a parent that took time away from them, that had all of the help and all of the caregiving. right now, I don't feel like I'm missing out on anything because I've been choosing and prioritizing showing up for them for the things that matter.
Sharon (16:27)
100%.
Yeah. And that's so powerful. And I, and I love that, that, you're there for them and yet you can have this dual, this dual real world.
Jo (16:50)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (16:52)
You know, you mentioned something about having an au pair. We had one too, to help me do the things that I didn't want to do so I could actually spend time with my kids. And I think that a lot of moms might struggle with that. It's like, yeah, you do deserve to have somebody.
Jo (16:55)
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (17:07)
who can help you out so you can manage this massive life with three children going three different directions and have that moment of like peace and tranquility, you know, for you, because that is so darn important.
Jo (17:11)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Look, and this is a journey that I've been on, right? So when we first started working with an au pair, we just had our second baby. And I was so weird about it. I was like, my gosh, you know, when I'm not with the baby, I'm a bad mother. Like, why am I even why am I having someone else do this for me? And like, it took me so long to get over.
that level of shame and guilt. And also because I've done so much research into the evolution and history of motherhood and we've never been meant to do this on our own, okay? We've always done this in a village. We've always had community in the past. We've always had help, okay? We've had sisters, we've had cousins, we've had mothers. We lived so close to other mothers.
Sharon (18:01)
I've had community in the past. Yeah.
Jo (18:13)
so that someone could pick up your baby when you wanna take a shower, okay? We don't really live in that world anymore. And so I've reached a point where, one, I will take all of the help that is offered to me at all times. just, anyone wanna come over and hold a baby? Cool, that sounds great to me. Because the more hands in my house, the better mom I can be.
Sharon (18:13)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Jo (18:39)
to each kid individually too. I mean, it's not just about like, I need these hours to work, but it's, I want one-on-one time with one of these children. So please help me with the other two. I wanna be at ballet with my daughter and I don't really want the other two running around the ballet lobby while I'm doing that because it's annoying to the other parents, to the ballet instructors. mean, so for me, it's just...
been creating more ease in our lives so that we can enjoy these wonderful lives that we have together and so that I can enjoy each of my kids.
Sharon (19:15)
Right.
Jo (19:19)
I feel really blessed, I'm really grateful that we're able to do this. We sacrifice so many other things, honestly, in our lives so that we can have this much help. I mean, we're like a one car family, right? We chose to live in a more affordable city.
so that we can do this. And I'm genuinely just a better mom because of it.
Sharon (19:44)
Thank you for sharing that and hopefully other moms getting that message that we're worth it and it's okay. And there's so many different ways to like raise a family and make it work. So I love the way you're making it work too. Hey, we're to take one more quick break. And when we come back, we are going to talk about your most recent book, The Sicilian Inheritance.
Jo (19:56)
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (21:06)
Hey, we're back. Okay, Joe,
quick question for you. How many podcasts do you actually have?
Jo (21:08)
Hmm.
such a great question. I make Under the Influence two episodes of that a week. We just revamped my podcast Committed, which I started eight years ago, which is, you know, interesting stories about marriage. But now we've expanded it. We've expanded it to other forms of commitment. And that is now dropping weekly. And I also because
Sharon (21:32)
yeah.
Jo (21:41)
his the season for all kinds of politics. I'm doing a show with Emily Amick of the at Emily in your phone Instagram account called We've Got Issues and that also drops once weekly.
Sharon (21:52)
Right.
And I've listened to that. That's very interesting. I'm enjoying that. Thank you so much. Okay. So before we get into Sicilian inheritance, which is your most recent book, I do have to tell you, I recently finished listening to Charlotte Walsh Likes to Win, did it on audio book. my God, that was so wonderful. So I would recommend that to my listeners. It's a great listen. Cause the person who is the,
Jo (21:58)
Yeah.
such a good one. Such a great book.
Mm. The narrator is wonderful. Yeah.
Sharon (22:18)
And she's got all these different voices. So it was
Jo (22:20)
Mm hmm.
Sharon (22:20)
really wonderful. Okay. So please give our listeners a little idea of what the Sicilian inheritance is all about. And is this a mix of fiction and nonfiction? Where does it fall in that regard?
Jo (22:23)
Yeah.
Mm.
yeah,
no, it's fiction. The Sicilian Inheritance is a novel through and through pure fiction. It is a delicious twisty turny adventure murder mystery set in Sicily with just the right amount of spice and romance. And then I just, you know, threw it all as you're having so much fun in Sicily slip in a little bit of taking down the patriarchy. But it's also
Sharon (22:58)
Just
because. Why not? Yeah, why not?
Jo (23:00)
Just be, why not? Why not? When you can.
But also really, it focuses a lot on being a mother. There's two main characters, Sarah, who was in the present day timeline. She's going back to Sicily to try to claim a family inheritance, a plot of land that's been left to her. And her great grandmother, Sarafina, from 100 years earlier.
who becomes a mother when she's just a teenager and she has to give up all of her ambitions to become a mother. Sarah is a mother of one in the present day and she's trying to be a chef and open a restaurant and also be a good mom at the same time. And so the book, while it is so much fun, I this is the most fun book I've ever written, really also explores how hard it is to be a mother in the world 100 years ago and then also today. Like we have not come.
that far when it comes to caring for mothers in the world.
Sharon (23:57)
Right,
right, so some things don't really change. I have to point out, I've got your book right here. I have to tell you, loved the read, it just really pulls you along. I also love that you write about these strong women. And even though present day Sarah is having her issues, right, she's struggling a little. Yeah, yeah, but she has it within herself and she discovers that, you know, to do what she needs to do.
Jo (24:02)
yay!
She's struggling, yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Sharon (24:26)
I loved reading about Serafina and what life was like in Sicily a hundred years ago. It is a wonderful, fabulous read. It made me hungry to go to Italy. Yeah. Yeah.
Jo (24:37)
Yeah, that's the plan. I mean, really, people
should read this book or listen to this book with food because it will make you very hungry. And both really, I'd like you to have wine, I'd like you to have cannolis, I'd like you to have all of the things.
Sharon (24:42)
Right? Or at least a really good glass of wine. Yeah. Yeah.
Right, exactly.
is that coming from you, this strong woman aspect? I would say yes, just from our chats and the time we spent together.
Jo (24:56)
Yeah,
yeah, I mean, so while the book is fiction, it is loosely, loosely based on my great great grandmother, Lorenza, who was our family matriarch in Sicily more than 100 years ago. And the family story is that she was indeed murdered in Sicily before she could come to America.
And that's really where the similarity does end because I wanted to write fiction and I wanted to explore what it would be like to be a woman left alone in Sicily during that time period. But I do think that I come from this line of very strong women and strong mothers. And one of the things I wanted to do with this book is we have lot of different kinds of strong women showing a lot of different kinds of strength. And I do think that in today's kind of
culture wars we've created this ridiculous kind of fake animosity between working moms and stay at home moms. And I don't even like the phrase stay at home mom because I'm like, who is staying? Who is just staying? No one is staying anywhere, OK? And so.
Sharon (25:55)
Yeah.
No one's staying. No one's staying.
Right, exactly.
Jo (26:08)
All of the women in the book, the ones who choose to work outside the home, the ones who choose to work inside the home, have so much strength in different ways. And I wanted to show that these women are all heroes of their stories, no matter what they choose to do inside or outside of the home.
Sharon (26:32)
Right,
right. I love where that's coming from. yeah, more stories like this need to be told. So thank you for that. We are unfortunately coming toward the end of our time together. And I have a question for you that I ask all of my moms who are on the podcast. And that is, since this is the Mom2More podcast, Joe Piazza, what is your more?
Jo (26:46)
Mmm. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
I recently wanted to do one thing that was just for me, but that also wasn't work, okay, because a lot of the things that I do for work are like other people's hobbies, right? Like, I write things, I make podcasts. Now I'm even like writing some TV shows. So it's like none of like the consuming of those things is like not even as fun for me anymore. So I decided I'm gonna get my pilot's license.
Because when I'm flying a plane, literally can't do anything else. there does not seem to be a way that I can monetize it.
Sharon (27:27)
That is so true.
True, true, wow, I'm impressed. You're the first mom pilot that I've had on the show, so go girl. Yeah, well, but it's a long-term process. Yeah, I love that. Thank you, thank you. And please tell my listeners where everyone can find you online. Everything, folks, is gonna be in the show notes, Instagram, website, books, you name it. Tell me where people can find you online.
Jo (27:38)
Well, let's see if I get it. I mean, I might not get the license, but we'll see. We'll see. I just started. Long-term process. Yeah. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah. So
I'm on on the Instagrams at Joe Piazza author and then my sub stack is called over the influence and my my big podcast is under the influence.
Sharon (28:08)
Love that. Okay. Joe, I'm so glad we finally got this together. You're a hoot. And I thank you. I love where you're coming from and then just how you're able to manage everything and be an awesome mom and produce all this awesome content that I love. And I really look forward to checking out your next book whenever that drops.
Jo (28:09)
Yeah. Me too. Thank you. This was so much fun.
you
No, it's gonna be good. That one's gonna be good. Yeah.
Sharon (28:35)
thank you.
Jo (28:34)
so much, this is so fun. Bye.